Friday, November 02, 2018

My Weekend Crushing Disappointment

After coming back from my honeymoon and finally catching up on Ye Olde Blog and your comments while I was away, I have to say I’m disappointed. I am particularly disappointed by some of the discriminatory and downright wrong comments on my Vacation Vixen post on Stephanie Beatriz. In particular it was all the disparaging and hateful comments about her marriage and her bisexuality, and bisexuality in general, that disappoints me.

Let me say definitively, for the record and without an iota of equivocation that bisexual women are a welcome part of the LGBTQ community. Bisexual women remain bisexual, even if they are in a relationship with or marry a man. And – for good measure because sometimes these vile views go hand in hand – trans women are also part of the LGBTQ community. Trans women are women, period. If you harbor any hateful feelings toward bisexual women or trans people, you are not welcome here. This is not the site for you. Go find another site. We will be perfectly fine, not to mention happier, without you.

Look, if you have had a bad experience while dating a bisexual woman, well, that was your individual experience. You’ve probably also had a bad experience dating a lesbian woman at some point in your life. But you don’t go lumping all lesbians into that one experience. I had a bad experience with a lesbian ergo all lesbians are bad. That’s just dumb.

Bisexuality by definition is an attraction to women and men. But being bisexual does not mean you have to be with men and women at the same time. It’s not the same as polyamory, per se. So, of course, some bisexual women will date and/or marry men – it’s in the damn definition of their sexual orientation. Still if a bisexual woman does marry a man that does not negate her overall sexuality. That does not make her straight.

Just like if a lesbian marries a woman she does not stop finding other women attractive. Like, I am now married to a woman I love completely and am deeply committed to and would never stray, but I can still low whistle at Cate Blanchett because CATE BLANCHETT. Bisexual women are still bisexual, still have the propensity to fall in love with and/or be attracted and/or feel a kinship to women and men regardless of their current relationship status. And saying a bisexual woman who is married to a man can only remain bisexual if she cheats with a woman is, um, nuts. It’s nuts. You would rather a bisexual woman be unfaithful and amoral than in a committed relationship with someone she loves who happens to be a man? What the what?

Are there “heteroflexible” women who take gaycations in lesboland for the fun of it with no intentions of putting down stakes because why not? Sure, of course. But I don’t think the vast majority of those women consider themselves bisexual or queer or pansexual or whathaveyou. They’re sexual tourists and, as long as everyone involved knows and consents to what they’ve getting into, that can be fine too.

This isn’t hard to understand, folks. It just isn’t. And if you willfully misconstrue bisexuality as trying to take advantage of straight privilege, then you’re just being willfully hateful. And, again, I would rather you leave.

The thing about being a part of the LGBTQ community is we’re a big gay umbrella to shelter all kinds of sexual otherness. Are you a woman who likes other women? Come on down. Are you a man who likes other men? Get over here. A woman who likes women and men? You betcha. A trans person attracted to men or women or non-binary folks? But of course, plenty of room. And so on and so forth. The whole idea of discriminating against someone because of who she or he or them or they may love or be attracted to should be antithetical to our very existence. We accept all, love all. At least, that’s how it should be.

The world is cold and cruel enough on its own for us to go around hating, disrespecting or being bigoted toward each other. Our governing principals should be equality, generosity and kindness. Literally the only kind of person I do not welcome here is the kind of person who discriminates against others for who they are – be that their race or their gender or their sexual identity or their sexual orientation. Because what a waste of a perfectly good human life to spend all of it hating someone for something they can’t change. Have a happy and accepting weekend, all.

Edited To Add:

To Anonymous Commenter 8:31 AM (in my time zone),
Hello. First of all, obviously you give a flying %^#! about what I think because you come here, to my personal blog, where I write my personal thoughts, and discuss my personal opinions, which no one is under any requirement to read unless they care about my personal thoughts and opinions. Otherwise, why even bother clicking? Second (because when you write “first” it is customary to provide a second) the right to free speech and expression as guaranteed by the First Amendment of the United State Constitution means freedom from government censorship of speech and expression. Not freedom from some lesbian blogger who does this on her free time for fun without any regular monetary compensation, but just because she loves and respects the LGBTQ community and its role in pop culture. I am sorry that is a confusing concept for you. Also, it is spelled “whether.” Now, goodbye.

To Anonymous Commenter 8:37 AM (again, in my time zone),
Hello. I never, let me repeat, never delete or censor comments on my blog unless they are spam. I believe the comments section is your space, and therefore also do not wade into the comments either. I have only once in the 12-plus year history of this blog commented in the comments section. That was an instance where I told someone to fuck off for disparaging a close personal friend and fellow writer. Otherwise, again, that is your space. That does not mean I cannot feel disappointment in what is written in the comments on occasion. Oh, and the comments against bisexuality are there, for everyone to read, in my Vacation Vixen post about Stephanie Beatriz which I linked above in this post. And, again right here. You know how links work, right? Also, using “bisexual lifestyle” is as offensive as using “gay lifestyle” or “lesbian lifestyle.” It is an orientation, and not a preference for oversized prints and hot yoga. Now, goodbye.

To the remaining/returning Anonymous Commenters:

36 comments:

Unknown said...

hear hear. love, not hate. acceptance, not discrimination.

thank you, Ms Snarker (Mrs Happy Wife)

love to you

Helena said...

Well said Dorothy. Just wonderful how you can put into words what I feel. Like you said love all, accept all. Have a wonderful weekend xxx

Anonymous said...

You are so damn right Ms Snarker. So damn right.
If the LGBTQI community can't process sexuality and gender in all their beautiful variantions, then this community is doomed.

Anonymous said...

Thank you, Merci, Gracias. It saddens me that this KEEPS needing to be said but I appreciate those who keep saying it.

SK said...

Agreed entirely. I don't see why this isn't intuitively obvious. I could be in a relationship with someone and there are going to be a hell of a lot of other people in the world that they're going to find attractive. But unless it's in the 'rules' of our relationship, that's all that is. "You can window shop all you want but you can't buy".

With bi people involved, why is this different? There's just more people that my partner could be theoretically attracted to. But there's no difference in kind. Does it somehow make a difference that now they have a potential 'attraction pool' of seven billion not 3.5 billion? Of course not, that would be ridiculous.

Have a suits and tank-tops sort of weekend, and thanks for what you do!

Anonymous said...

First of all Dorothy, are you kidding me? Who gives a flying %^#! wether or not you are disappointed? FREE Speech and freedom of expression. Get Over It.

Carmen SanDiego said...

“The world is cold and cruel enough on its own for us to go around hating, disrespecting or being bigoted toward each other. “
Perfect
Have a great weekend Mrs and Mrs DS

Anonymous said...

Are you censoring comments that you do not like or are disappointed by? Where are the comments against bisexuality and why don't bisexuals understand the reasons that some lesbians do not like the bisexual lifestyle?

YOU ARE THE ONE WHO IS DISAPPOINTING

Anonymous said...

I’m so glad you wrote this DS. You put into words exactly how I was feeling after reading those comments. But I’m terrible at expressing myself, you’re my hero:)

Anonymous said...

Well said! I totally agree.

Kirsten said...

This is a comment area on your blog, your space and your rules. If you wanted to remove comments which are hateful then I think that is 100% your right. As someone who identifies as bisexual, I appreciate your stance that all identities are welcome in the playpen of life. Keep doing what you do, it is appreciated.

Maria Rigel said...

Thanks, Dorothy. I am a bisexual woman, currently in a monogamous relationship with a man, and really appreciate you making this clear. Just because I'm in a monogamous relationship with a man, I haven't stopped enjoying looking at good-looking women and checking on a blog that selects for me the sort of things I may enjoy looking at. How hard is that to process, people?

Holly said...

Ms Snarker, I have enjoyed reading your blog for years. It's seriously my lesbian culture touchstone. What a shame to come back from the high of a honeymoon to the lows of internet trolling. So I wanted to say how very much I enjoy your work and appreciate the effort you put into this blog. Don't let the bastards get you down.

HK

Tammy said...

Preach! I used to be young and ignorant and did not understand bisexuality, nor did I understand my own lesbianism but here's what I did---educated myself. Thanks so much! I have read this blog for years and love it. Sorry for the stupidity of some folks. Some people think "anonymous" gives them the right to be disrespectful. Funny, how they did not make comments about the straight women in your recent posts? humph. All are welcome in this community!!!

Morag said...

Hope you feel welcome here :-)

Morag said...

She doesn't censor comments on her blog. I'm interested in your use of "lifestyle", do you not recognise that as a word that is often used to attack lesbian and gay people as well? We're LGBTQI, please respect the B.

Danielle Warby said...

Right on Mrs. Snarker.

I find this useful to send to people who bang on about free speech and don't actually know what it means: https://xkcd.com/1357/

Anonymous said...

I appreciate the fact that you called out bi discrimination. It's the last bastion of prejudice to disparage bi people, but you kicked it in the ass. The way I explain bisexuality to my lesbian friends is this...When I see a good looking couple, I enjoy looking at both of them. I think some people are jealous that bi folks have a larger sea of fish than other people do. The down side is the confusion in adolescence. As if that isn't a completely horrible time anyway. I loved a girl and a boy at the same time and I thought I was insane. Then I fell in love at 18 with a girl. Then I dated a guy. Then I fell in love with a woman. Then I married a man. Then I fell in love with a woman. I'm single and not looking these days.

Anonymous said...

It's disappointing that your wonderfully kind, funny, thoughtful, smart as hell space gets invaded by ignorant, mean, shallow thoughtless people. I'm sorry you have to deal with this nonsense. Mama didn't teach them the golden rule...ain't got nothing nice to say? SHHHHHHH Go elsewhere. Reading your daily musings is consistently my favorite treat of the day - the other 23.8 hours is dark and scary and depressing anymore. Keep on keeping on friend. All you haters....go on now...git.

revpet said...

I am curious, is a woman who identifies as bi, less bi if she is in a long term relationship with a woman? Does she need to step out on her partner with a man to keep her bi street cred intact? No, that is ludicrous, and it is no different the other way around. So please take your troll lifestyles to some other space. So we can happily enjoy the lovely queer women in tank tops, in peace.

Anonymous said...

Nobody is "hateful" of bisexuals, seriously this is a strawman. What many bi women call biphobia is simply self-preservation from lesbians who don't want to be used. And frankly I will start taking bisexuals seriously when they stop pestering me on Tinder/okcupid looking for threesomes for their little boyfriend. But I guess mean lesbians don't get to have sexual boundaries since they're apparently obligated to date bisexuals (isn't it hilarious how they never seem to date each other?) and now we have to date creepy men in dress too. It's a shame I used to love your blog but I shouldn't be surprised since you work for Autostraddle and this website has been pushing the trans ideology for a long time now. "Anything but actual lesbians" should be their name, that would be more honest. Hopefully you will hit peak trans at some point. But I'm not holding my breath since admitting you supported a misogynistic homophobic and regressive ideology is admitting you were a fool and who ever admits that?

Anonymous said...

Writing that as a lesbian, I find that the majority of bisexual women i have crossed paths with, seem to always commit to men but sexually use the same sex. If you consider that discrimination, then I can't help you.

Not all lesbians agree with bisexuality and your well trained "Kittens" need to back the F away from trying to attack dissenters, Let me make That Unequivocally clear.

Anonymous said...

Morag,

I used the word: "Lifestyle" because while there is no irrefutable force that is making me homosexual, I still CHOOSE to live my life mas an Out lesbian and I choose to identify as such even when I am not in a relationship.

Being over 50 years old, of course I know the history of discrimination that lesbians have historically faced. What arer you going to educate me because you don't think II know?

revpet said...

To the lady who believes you are not innately gay, that it is a choice, my heart breaks for you. As for the ladies who have been burned by bisexual women, sorry for your bad luck, but please don't demonize an entire portion of OUR community. As for the Transphobia, you should be ashamed of yourselves. This thread is just a reminder to me, of how we got where we are, white women, including gay white women full of hate. As a white queer woman, who has only ever identified as a lesbian, in a deep red state, I see it everyday. Everyone has to fit neatly in a perfect box that is easily explained for your sensitive simplistic sensibilities.

Anonymous said...

Listen, this is a sensitive topic because so many lesbians have been hurt by bisexuals through the years. I've heard a lot of negativity in the bar scene about bisexual women. Maybe some is warranted. But a lot of it is hear-say. I personally don't associate with bisexual women but wouldnt hold anyone who does with less regard.

jc said...

Good on ya, Ms. Snarker.

Anonymous said...

I love you, Dorothy, and very well said.

Nici75 said...

As a polyamorous dyke-- To everyone who thinks that bisexual people (of any gender) cannot possibly be interested in monogamy, too... Whut? No, seriously-- I quite doubt you've ever really talked *WITH* anyone bisexual. You've talked *TO* them and you've talked *AT* them. Talking *WITH* people requires LISTENING, LEARNING, and ACCEPTING that you were misinformed.

You go, DS. Thanks for standing up and speaking up.

Anonymous said...

Im very disappointed that a (small?) segment of the lesbian community is so hateful. There seems to be a section of lesbian separatists that believe inclusion will somehow erase their own identities. These women are largely white and frankly their sexism and racism is equally as disturbing as the Republican hate spewed. Why cant everyone just let others be themselves? Does it matter who people are sleeping with in their own homes?

Anonymous said...

How many homophobic, racist, sexist comments have been made in the name of free speech?
That's usually the trademark of morons. Facist morons.

Anonymous said...

The Trans IDEOLOGY? What happened to the gay agenda?
I'm too old for this nonsense.

Flo said...

So we should just shut up? Because you've met some unreliable PEOPLE, we should let you condemn a big part of the LGBTQI community?
What's next? If you cross path with an unfriendly baker, WE should stop eating bread?


Anonymous said...

"Anonymous Anonymous said...

Im very disappointed that a (small?) segment of the lesbian community is so hateful. There seems to be a section of lesbian separatists that believe inclusion will somehow erase their own identities."

THE PERFECT RESPONSE:

"I'm too old for this nonsense."

MILLENNIAL WAVES OF NONSENSE

Anonymous said...

Well thank the Goddess that my graduate school education ensured that my sense of self (ergo: my Identity) remains static regardless of any dissenting view I hold towards bisexuality.

And isn't that what 'Identity" is really all about? Some women have not developed their identity where it is at a stage that no matter what occurs around them they know who they are and are unwavering in their sexual identity.

So it isn't that lesbian separatists have a shaky sense of self, it's more of the flippant bisexual who refuses to admit the fact their main allegiance is and has always been with members of the opposite sex, and they get mad at some lesbians many of us refuse to wear blinders. I have previously written that: Everyone wants to be Loved and Accepted and even though I have never knowingly been romantically involved with a bisexual woman, the mere fact that of the many who expressed an interest in me we mmarried to men, let me repeat: All ofr the bisexual women who were interested in me are married to MEN!

So where did their interested in me lay? i was solely sexual.

I am over 50 years old, so I don't take issue with women who are attracted to both sexes, but i do have a major beef with them trying to flip the script and indict me for discriminating against them.

There is no universal rule that states if I experienced discrimination as a result of my ethnicity, skin color or sexual orientation, that I am obliged to issue a blanket acceptance of anyone for any reason.

Anonymous said...

Well said, Snarker

Anonymous said...

Well said, and thank you.

I'm late to this but came by because I'm trying to find out AfterEllen's take on Meghan Murphy and how the lesbian community is dealing with these crazy issues, which may just be a big deal on social media but not so much in the real world...I don't know. But it does seem pretty crappy for a feminist to have their speech banned for certain viewpoints. That seems to be the position of AfterEllen's editor, Memoree Joelle and tbh it's mine, too.

I'm a feminist, a lesbian, a mother of a 13 yo daughter that my partner and I were blessed to have with the help of IVF. I'm also old (50) and so not a part of this new generation. I never in my life thought I would ever be fighting about an equality issue but here I am asking questions and wondering what I'm missing.

Hoping to see you and other others at AfterEllen share some thoughts or ideas on the subject.

Thank you!